15 Best Zero Waste Shampoo and Conditioners Without the B.S.

Despite their eco-friendly packaging, many “zero waste” shampoo and conditioners today actually contain unsustainable and harmful ingredients that can cause harm to the environment and your health.

And while plastic-free packaging is a prerequisite, there are other things to consider when shopping for a zero waste hair shampoo and conditioners…

Especially if you’re looking for the best.

So without further ado, let’s shampoo…

How to pick the best zero waste shampoo and conditioners?

Many brands today are merely “greenwashing” or making misleading claims to appeal to the eco-conscious market. 

So when shopping for genuine zero waste shampoo and conditioners, look for:

  • Palm Oil Free – Palm trees only grow in tropical regions, so rainforest is being cleared to make way for palm tree plantations. The clearing process produces tons of CO2 emissions, destroys natural habitats, and causes massive biodiversity loss.
  • SLS-free – SLS (Sodium lauryl sulfate) is a surfactant(foaming agent) that can cause minor irritations to sensitive skin such as itchy scalp, hair damage, and even hair loss.
  • Cruelty-free – The product and the ingredients used in creating the product were not tested on animals. Look for accreditation such as Cruelty-Free International, Leaping Bunny, or PETA Certified.
  • Vegan – Vegan products contain no animal ingredients or animal by-products.
  • Organic Ingredients – Organic ingredients are grown without pesticides, synthetic fertilizers, and harmful chemicals.

We reviewed dozens of zero waste shampoos and conditioners with the above in mind, and came up with 15 products we considered to be the best.

Our Top Choices

We regard these three as the overall top ranked zero waste shampoo due to their eco-friendliness and ethicality in production.

Bestowed Essentials Natural Aloe & Tea Tree Shampoo Bar

Bestowed Essentials Natural Aloe & Tea Tree Shampoo Bar
  • 100% Plastic-Free Packaging
  • Pail Oil Free
  • Vegan and Cruelty-Free
  • SLS-Free
  • Manufactured in solar-powered facilities

Ethique Eco-Friendly Solid Shampoo Bars

Ethique Eco-Friendly Solid Shampoo Bars
  • 100% Plastic-Free Packaging
  • Pail Oil Free
  • Vegan and Cruelty-Free
  • SLS-Free
  • Doesn’t leave a dry and stripped hair feeling

J.R.LIGGETT’S All-Natural Shampoo Bar

J.R.LIGGETT’S All-Natural Shampoo Bar
  • 100% Plastic-Free Packaging
  • Pail Oil Free
  • Vegan and Cruelty-Free
  • SLS-Free
  • Budget-Friendly

Zero Waste Shampoo and Conditioners Comparison Table

Zero Waste ShampoosPlastic freePalm Oil FreeVegan
Bestowed Essentials Natural Shampoo BarsYesYesYes
Ethique Eco-Friendly Solid Shampoo BarsYesYesYes
J.R.LIGGETT'S All-Natural Shampoo BarYesYesYes
Eco Roots Zero Waste Shampoo BarsYesYesYes
Meow Meow Tweet Shampoo BarsYesYesYes
HiBar Solid Shampoo Bar and Conditioner Bar SetYesYesYes
Friendly Soap Natural Shampoo BarYesYesNo
Whiff Botanicals Unscented Shampoo and ConditionerYesYesNo
Bossman 4-in-1 Men's Bar SoapYesYesYes
Lush Vegetarian Shampoo BarYesYesYes
BambooEarth Solid Shampoo BarYesYesYes
Plaine Products Eco-Friendly ShampooYesYesYes
Aspen Kay Naturals Solid Shampoo BarYesNoYes
The Yellow Bird Solid Bar Shampoo SoapYesNoYes
Soapbox Eco-Friendly Solid Shampoo BarNoYesYes

1. Bestowed Essentials Natural Aloe & Tea Tree Shampoo Bar


Bestowed Essentials is an ethical beauty company that sells a variety of eco-friendly and zero-waste products.

It’s Natural Aloe & Tea Tree Shampoo Bar is free from parabens, sulfates, palm oil, artificial colors or fragrances, vegan, and a PETA certified cruelty-free product.

It is handmade in the USA, manufactured in facilities with energy from renewable solar power, and comes in an aluminum tin. All shipping packaging is also plastic-free.

And for every purchase made, Bestowed Essentials collects and recycles 1lb of beach trash through their partnership with Ocean Blue Project.

So you’re not just reducing your waste when using this shampoo bar but also helping take care of other people’s wastes.

The price starts at $11.99 for a 4oz shampoo bar.


  • Lathers well yet easy to rinse
  • Manufactured in solar-powered facilities
  • Bestowed Essentials collects and recycles beach trash for every order


  • Some users report their hair feeling oily and very heavy
  • Aluminum tin containers don’t have much use than to be sent into recycling centers

2. Ethique Eco-Friendly Solid Shampoo Bars


Ethique is a company based in New Zealand and a very popular brand that sells sustainable and eco-friendly personal products.

The company’s zero waste shampoo bars are palm oil-free, vegan, cruelty-free, and SLS free.

They are suitable for men and women, straight and curly hair, damaged hair, hair with dandruff, and even people with very sensitive skin!

They are easy to use, concentrated, and come in 100% plastic-free packaging.

Ethique’s solid shampoo bars are available in 8 different scents and variants, including Frizz Wrangler, Kiwi, Sweet & Spicy, Damage Control, and 4 others.

Price starts at $15.99 for a 3.88oz (110g) zero waste shampoo bar.


  • No strong smell after every wash
  • It doesn’t leave a dry and stripped hair feeling
  • Plenty of scents and variants to choose from


  • Some users report the shampoo us hard to rinse

3. J.R.LIGGETT’S All-Natural Shampoo Bar


As the name suggests, J.R.LIGGETT’S All-Natural Shampoo Bar is made without synthetic oils, detergents, or chemicals.

It is ideal for those with allergies or sensitivities as it is gentle and safe for all hair and skin types with a mild clean scent derived from essential oils.

J.R.LIGGETT’S All-Natural Shampoo Bar is vegan, cruelty-free, SLS-free, and contains no palm oil. It also comes in 6 different scents and variants. 

This shampoo works for straight and curly hair and helps remove the built-up sebum (an oily, waxy substance produced by our body) that can clog and damage hair follicles.

This zero waste shampoo bar also promotes radiant, shiny hair even without a conditioner.

A single bar is approximately equal to 24ozs of liquid shampoo and comes in plastic-free packaging.

The price starts at $9.49 for a 3.5oz (99g) bar.


  • Budget-friendly
  • Lathers very well
  • Promotes healthy hair growth


  • Hard to rinse
  • Some user reports dry hair feeling

4. Eco Roots Zero Waste Shampoo Bars


Eco Roots is a zero waste product brand based in Aspen, Colorado. They sell eco-friendly, sustainable, and ethically sourced home products.

The Eco Roots zero waste shampoo bars are palm oil-free, SLS-free, cruelty-free, and vegan. They are also color-safe, silicone-free, phthalate-free, paraben-free, and handmade in the USA.

Suitable for all kinds of hairs, these zero waste shampoo for men and women lathers well without stripping natural oils from your hair, and they smell great.

A single shampoo bar lasts for around 50 washes and comes in Citrus Fresh, Cocolime Colada, Fresh Mint, Honeydew, and 4 other scents and variants.

The Eco Roots zero waste shampoo bars also come in plastic-free packaging and shipping.

Price Starts at $10.50 for a 2.25oz bar.


  • Small but last long
  • Smells great but not overpowering
  • Plenty of scents to choose from


  • A little pricey
  • Some users report it makes their hair dry

5. Meow Meow Tweet Shampoo Bars


Meow Meow Tweet Shampoo Bars are created by a skincare company that makes vegan products with pure, all-natural, and organic ingredients.

This zero waste shampoo is made with unrefined plant oils and butter, organic and wild-crafted botanicals, and steam-distilled and cold-pressed essential oils.

The Meow Meow Tweet Shampoo Bars are Leaping Bunny cruelty-free certified, SLS-free, and doesn’t contain palm oil. It also comes in a paper box.

It works for both straight and curly hairs, produces a rich lather, and has a sweet yet gentle herbal scent. You can use this shampoo bar as a body soap too!

Price starts at $12 per 4.5oz (126g) bar.


  • Budget-friendly
  • Lathers quickly with small water
  • It has a sweet yet mild scent


  • Some users report a dry feeling on their hair

6. HiBar Solid Shampoo and Conditioner Bar Set

HiBar-Zero-Waste-Solid Shampoo-Bar-And-Conditioner-Bar-Set

HiBar is another famous brand for zero waste shampoo and conditioners. 

Their shampoo and conditioner bars are made in the USA and 100% safe for colored hair.

They are also palm oil-free, soap-free, sulfate-free, phthalate-free, silicone-free, paraben-free, and cruelty-free, 

This zero waste shampoo bar is infused with African dates and Vitamin B5 to add body and definition without weighing down your hair.

HiBar’s shampoo bar and conditioner are suitable for straight and curly hair. One shampoo bar is said to last at least as long as a 16oz bottle.

HiBAR guarantees 100% plastic-free packaging and shipping of their shampoo and conditioner products, which comes in three variants – Volumize, Maintain, and Moisture.

Price starts at $26.50 per set (3.2oz zero-waste shampoo bar and 3.2oz conditioner bar)


  • It has a good yet gentle smell
  • Made to last as long as a 16oz liquid shampoo
  • Infused with ingredients that add body and definition to your hair


  • Expensive
  • Hard to rinse, according to some users
  • The unconventional shape makes applying the product on hair time consuming

7. Friendly Soap Natural Shampoo Bar


All Friendly Soap products are formulated to comply with the EU and UK Cosmetics Safety Regulations (EC (No) 1223/2009), so you can rest assured that their safety is top-notch.

The Friendly Soap natural shampoo bar contains natural essential oils and is handmade with natural ingredients.

It doesn’t contain palm oil, parabens, sulfates, triclosan, phthalates and is cruelty-free.

This zero waste shampoo bar has a lovely smell that is not too flowery or masculine. It also lathers well and rinses well. 

Castor oil is added to the shampoo bar to create a deeply conditioning and creamy lather.

The Friendly Soap natural shampoo bar comes in two scents of Lavender & Tea Tree and Lavender & Geranium and comes in plastic-free packaging.

Price starts at $6.20 for a 3.35oz (95g) bar.


  • Budget-friendly
  • Smells terrific without being overpowering
  • Formulated to comply with the EU and UK Cosmetics Safety Regulations


  • It might contain animal-derived ingredients
  • Users report that it is hard to rinse and leaves a waxy residue
  • It might cause a wet and greasy sensation

8. Whiff Botanicals Unscented Shampoo Bar and Conditioner Set


For people who are sensitive to smell, this set of unscented zero waste shampoo and conditioner bar is perfect for you.

The Whiff Botanicals unscented shampoo bar and conditioner are made with a natural concentrated formula for both men and women and all hair types. 

It contains no artificial colorings and fragrances, palm oil, SLS, SLES, parabens, cocamide, and silicone. These hair products are also cruelty-free, and made in the USA.

But the main reason this product is in our list of the best zero waste shampoo and conditioners is because it is made using the fewest ingredients possible.

Whiff Botanicals claims that many brands today use too many ingredients (some are unnecessary) on their products, which produces more waste and consumes natural resources.

And when you order the Whiff Botanicals unscented shampoo bar and conditioner online, you can rest assured that there will be no plastic in packaging or shipping.

Price starts at $16.99 for a 3.4oz bar.


  • Perfect for scent-sensitive individuals
  • No wasted ingredients and water
  • Made with a contracted formula to last longer


  • Expensive
  • Not vegan (Might contain animal-derived ingredients)
  • Some users reported their hair felt dry and brittle after washing

9. Bossman 4-in-1 Men’s Bar Soap


A men’s bar soap? What is this doing on this list of zero waste shampoo and conditioners?

The Bossman men’s bar soap functions as a hair shampoo, conditioner, beard wash, and body wash!

It is a 4-in-1 soap bar made with natural moisturizing oils, including organic coconut oil and organic shea butter. It doesn’t contain harsh foaming agents that can dry out hair and skin.

What could be more zero waste than a product that helps you avoid buying more personal products, thus, minimizing waste from production, shipping, and packaging?

The Bossman men’s bar soap is made in the USA, vegan, cruelty-free, and palm oil-free.

When used as a shampoo, it lathers very well in both soft and hard water, leaving a seductive manly scent derived from natural essential oils of Geranium, Lavender, Vanilla, Rosemary, and Patchouli.

And while the Bossman 4-in-1 men’s bar soap is designed for men, it ranks very high on our list because this can be used in place of four different products. 

Not to mention it’s a great way to save money!

Price starts at $9.99 per 4.5oz bar.


  • Affordable
  • 4-1 soap for men (shampoo, conditioner, beard care, body soap)
  • Doesn’t leave a film or residue on body or hair


  • May or may not contain sulfates
  • Strong patchouli smell
  • Some users report the soap begins to fall apart only after a few uses

10. Lush Vegetarian Shampoo Bars


Lush is a very well-known brand that sells plastic-free shampoos and conditioners. Their products are designed for both straight and curly hair.

Lush Vegetarian Shampoo Bars are concentrated pucks of shampoo made with natural essential oils and fresh ingredients.

These shampoos are 100% percent vegetarian, vegan, cruelty-free, and don’t contain palm oil.

Lush has a range of vegetarian shampoo bars that are said to last up to 80 washes, enough to outlast two to three bottles of the liquid shampoo!

If you order online, their products will be sent in biodegradable vegetable-based cellulose. 

But if you buy them in local stores near you, the Lush vegetarian shampoo bars are completely package-free (naked) as you can see in the image above.

Price starts at $11.95 per 1.9oz shampoo puck.


  • Lathers well in both soft and hard water
  • Small but concentrated formula
  • Naked packaging


  • May or may not contain SLS and other sulfates
  • Some users report that the scent can be too strong
  • Other claims that it takes some time to rinse the shampoo thoroughly

11. BambooEarth Solid Shampoo Bar


These zero waste shampoo bars from BambooEarth are palm oil-free, vegan, and cruelty-free.

They’re made using 100% organic, all-natural, and plant-based essential oils and packed in a biodegradable packaging.

The BambooEarth Solid Shampoo Bars are said to naturally nourish, treat and restore your hair to its original shiny state.

They also have a conditioner effect, leaving your hair soft and shiny after every wash.

The BambooEarth Solid Shampoo Bars are super easy to use, lathers great, smells good and can last two months for a single person to use.

The BambooEarth Solid Shampoo Bar And Conditioner comes in different scents and variants, including Bamboo Charcoal, Seaweed, Chamomile, Ginger Coconut, Honey, Jasmine, and 8 others.

One thing worth mentioning is that BambooEarth offers a 100% refund for unsatisfied customers.

The price starts at $9.87 for a 2oz (60g) shampoo bar.


  • Affordable
  • 100% Money back guarantee
  • Zero waste shampoo and conditioner in one


  • May or may not contain SLS and other sulfates
  • Some reported it causes dandruff

12. Plaine Products Eco-Friendly Shampoo


Plaine Products eco-friendly shampoo comes in a reusable and refillable metal container.

It is SLS-free, cruelty-free, vegan, palm oil-free, and made with a biodegradable formula – with no artificial scents.

Many people love this eco-friendly shampoo because it doesn’t leave your hair dry and brittle (like being stripped from natural oils), so you won’t need a conditioner. 

It also lathers and bubbles up quickly without using too much water and is easy to rinse as well.

However, this shampoo is at the lower half of this list because, in our opinion, sending empty bottles to the company for a refill and then shipping it to you again will leave more carbon footprint.

Furthermore, this shampoo is liquid, so you probably can’t carry this with you if you’re traveling via plane, or you’ll risk getting in trouble with the TSA.

Hence, you would need to buy another shampoo when traveling, which is not really “zero wastely.”

Nonetheless, we highly recommend Plaine Products if you’re looking for a zero waste shampoo and conditioners for daily use at home.

The price starts at  $30 for a 16oz (473ml) metal bottle.

Scents: Rosemary Mint Vanilla and Citrus Lavender


  • Suits both straight and curly hairs
  • It doesn’t make your hair dry or dull
  • It has a mild, gentle smell


  • Expensive
  • Not a travel-friendly shampoo
  • Sending empty bottles to the company for a refill will cause more carbon footprint

13. Aspen Kay Naturals Solid Shampoo Bar


Aspen Kay Naturals Solid Shampoo Bar is made with natural and organic ingredients.

It is handcrafted in the USA, sulfate-free, vegan, cruelty-free, silicone-free, and paraben-free.

This zero waste shampoo bar is infused with hair-loving herbs such as organic nettle and organic turmeric to stimulate healthy hair growth, repair damaged hair, and restore the hair’s natural luster. 

It lathers well and cleans without stripping your hair and scalp’s protective oils. It also leaves a beautiful yet gentle fragrance.

This soild shampoo also comes in a non-plastic boxes, and one shampoo bar is equivalent to three 6oz bottles of liquid shampoo.

Aspen Kay Naturals Solid Shampoo Bars scents: Rosemary & Peppermint or Lemongrass & Sweet Orange.

Price starts at $13.99 per 3oz shampoo bar.


  • Scented using 100% pure essential oils
  • Promotes healthy hair growth
  • One bar can last as three 6oz liquid shampoo bottles


  • It might contain palm oil (cetyl alcohol and ​sodium cocoyl Isethionate)
  • Some users claims the shampoo bar broke apart immediately after a few uses
  • Others reported getting mild scalp allergies

14. The Yellow Bird Solid Bar Shampoo Soap


The Yellow Bird bar shampoo is sulfate-free, silicone-free, paraben-free, cruelty-free, vegan, and non-GMO. 

This zero waste shampoo is said to be great for sensitive scalps. It contains no synthetic fragrances, dyes, and harsh chemicals that can strip hair of natural protective oils, and some people may find irritating.

Moreover, this shampoo bar is advertised as a natural alternative for psoriasis shampoo or dandruff shampoo since it is infused with kaolin clay, sea salt, and trace vitamins minerals, providing organic hair care for dry hair, oily hair, and thin hair.

It is also an all-in-one eco-friendly shampoo bar for men and women that can be used as a body soap, face soap, or shave soap. 

Finally, The Yellow Bird bar shampoo comes in Grapefruit Rosemary Lavender, Peppermint, and Eucalyptus Tree scents in a non-plastic recyclable box.

The price starts at $10 for a 4.5oz bar.


  • Budget-friendly
  • Hydrate and protect hair from frizz
  • It can also be used as a body soap, face soap, or shaving soap


  • Contains palm oil
  • Some users report a dry and icky feeling after wash

15. Soapbox Eco-Friendly Solid Shampoo Bar


And the final entry on our list of 15 best zero waste shampoo and conditioners this year is the shampoo bar from Soapbox.

Soapbox Eco-Friendly Solid Shampoo Bar is made in the USA and a hair color-safe shampoo. It is also vegan, cruelty-free, gluten-free, and doesn’t contain harsh chemicals, including SLES, SLS, and parabens.

This shampoo is formulated for all hair types for men and women and infused with argan oil and Vitamin E to tame frizz and promotes soft-to-the-touch hair.

The Soapbox Eco-Friendly Solid Shampoo Bars comes in different scents of Tea Tree, Activated Charcoal, Argan Oil, and Coconut Oil.

We love this brand because, for every purchase of this shampoo, the company donates a bar of soap to someone in need, supporting their soap=hope mission.

You can track your contribution by entering your Hope Code found on the back of your shampoo bar on the Soapbox website.

Price starts at $14.99 per 3.1oz (87.5g)


  • It has a clean yet gentle scent 
  • Lathers well and rinses cleanly
  • Soapbox donates a bar of soap to people in need


  • The packaging is not 100% plastic-free
  • Some users with curly hair report the shampoo didn’t have excellent results on them
  • Others claim it made their hair feel dry and stringy


Why is shampoo bad for the environment?

Ever asked yourself “is shampoo eco-friendly?”

Well, most conventional liquid shampoos aren’t.

The obvious reason is that they are in liquid form, so most of them have to be contained in plastic bottles.

Secondly, unlike small shampoo bars, liquid shampoos are bulky and heavy so they create more carbon footprint during shipping.

Bulky containers take up so much space in transport while heavy cargo require more fuel to ship.

Third, many shampoos contain harmful chemicals and unsustainable ingredients.

For instance, most shampoos contain SLS (Sodium Laureth Sulfate), a foaming agent that can be harmful to aquatic animals when released into the environment.

Another common ingredient in shampoos is palm oil. 

Palm trees only grow in tropical regions, so to produce palm oil, rainforests are being cleared to make way for palm tree plantations, resulting in tons of CO2 emissions, destroying wild natural habitats, and causing massive biodiversity loss.

Most liquid shampoos you can find today are not eco-friendly.

Why should you switch to shampoo bars?

One of the most commonly asked questions regarding this topic is, “Are shampoo bars better than shampoo?”

Making the switch to shampoo bars is an excellent first step for anyone planning to live a zero waste lifestyle.

First, most shampoo bars today come in plastic-free packaging – no further explanation is required here.

Secondly, many shampoo bars act like shampoo and conditioner as one. Some can even be used as body soap or beard cleaning essential.

The less product you use, the better for the environment because it means less waste, less carbon footprint, and fewer resources consumed.

Do I need to use a conditioner with a shampoo bar?

Most of the zero waste shampoo bars on this list claim that you don’t need a conditioner when using them.

But it highly depends on your hair type and what product you are using.

Can shampoo bars cause hair loss?

According to Medical News Today, hair loss’s top causes include genetics, diseases, and taking medications. Washing your hair with shampoo and conditioner isn’t one of them.

However, shampoo ingredients that can cause irritations such as SLS might strip your hair of natural oils or leave a dry, itchy scalp, hence, encouraging hair loss. (source)

Moreover, artificial dyes and fragrances can also irritate sensitive scalps.

So when shopping for shampoo bars, it’s best to avoid products that contain known irritants like SLS and artificial ingredients.

Also, every person’s hair is different. Keep an eye on your shampoo bar ingredients and pay attention to which can cause hair loss in your personal experience.

How often should you wash your hair with a shampoo bar?

When it comes to taking care of our hair, every person differs from another. We each have different needs, and for that reason, we can’t tell you what is right for you.

So instead, let us ask you a question. 

Why do you shampoo your hair? Isn’t it to clean our scalp from dirt and sebum build-up?

Then, it’s totally up to you when you feel the need to shampoo your hair. Every other day, once a week, once a month, it’s up to you.

However, shampooing every day and exposing your hair to foreign chemicals might strip your hair of natural oils, leaving it dry and brittle.

Fortunately, most zero waste shampoo and conditioner bars on this list are made of natural ingredients. They are also infused with vitamins and minerals to strengthen and promote healthy hair growth.

Nonetheless, how often you shampoo your hair is something only you can answer.

Why does your hair feel waxy after using a shampoo bar? Do shampoo bars make hair greasy?

There are many explanations for why a person’s hair feels waxy after using a shampoo bar.

Others say that it’s because the scalp rebalances the pH and oil production in your hair (aka transition period), while others blame the ingredients present in the shampoo bar.

However, one of the most plausible explanations is that many shampoo bars are made with different mixing oils such as coconut oil and olive oil.

So if you’re using hard water when washing your hair, the shampoo bar oil molecules can bind into the minerals in the water and will leave waxy deposits in your hair. 

This is unlikely to happen if you’re using soft water instead.

But if you’re using soft water and the issue remains, then it could also be that the ingredients on your current shampoo bar are not suitable for your hair type.

Final Thoughts

That was quite a long list!

Anyways, we hope the 15 best zero waste shampoo and conditioners above can help you achieve a zero waste hair care routine.

Moreover, isn’t it good learn the other things to consider, besides plastic-free packaging, when looking for legitimate zero waste shampoo and conditioners?

Well, now, you are wiser than ever.

So, which of the zero waste shampoos and conditioner above you like best?

Have you tried any of them?


  1. Too many have no clue that fast hair growth shampoos (obviously with no sulfates, no parabens and no DEA) even exist. People can now possess longer hair and experience more possibilities. Certainly worth researching.

    If you’re going over alopecia, damaged hair, preventing scalp disorders, hair growth, hair and scalp health at large, almost the same ideas apply.

    Generally, you have to stay away from hair products and treatments that include chemicals such as parabens, DEA and sulfates.

    What is healthy for your hair is healthy for your skin as well.

    It goes without saying your content above hits the nail in the head for various reasons. It stays away from the common errors and traps too many fall into- purchasing defective alternatives. Thank you so much!

    1. We’re honored to receive such a positive comment from you Yvette. Thank you for sharing your thoughts about zero waste shampoos as well. Stay safe!

  2. Fantastic list with lots of good shampoo options, thank you. Weve obviously tried Ethique but its nice to know there are a few ecofriendly shampoo alternatives to fall back in to. At the moment, me and my hubby are using JR Liggets and its doing great! We will try the #4 on your list next, cant wait.

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